Debt by a Thousand Little Cuts….

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In Medieval times, supposedly, there was a punishment called “death by a thousand cuts,” designed to make the process as long and as painful as possible. In modern times, the state does what amounts to the same thing to our finances – and thus, to our financial security – via a tower of taxes and fees on everything we do and everything we (supposedly) own.

Consider for instance the annual “registration” fees we (most of us) are forced to pay every single year in return for the privilege of having yet another scrap of government-issued paper in our glovebox (and maybe another ugly little sticker to put on the license plate that we also had to pay for, separately). Here in Virginia as in many other states, the Graspers recently upped the ante to almost $50 a year per vehicle, in perpetuity. By itself – and assuming you’ve only got one car- sending the Graspers another $50 may not seem like a very big deal. But, consider:

You were forced to pay tax on the car when you first purchased it. In Virginia, the tax on the purchase itself is 3 percent. So, if you bought a modestly priced used car – let’s say you spent $15,000 on it – the Graspers will expect you to hand over $450. The hit on a brand-new $32,000 car – something along the lines of a new Mustang GT – would be almost $1,000. (And if that new car gets less than the government-decreed minimum MPGs, there will be a line-item “gas guzzler” tax added to the purchase price of the car. This additional tax can be $1,000 or more piled on top of everything else.)

Even this would be not so bad, though – if that’s where it ended. But as we all know, that’s where it starts.

Next up, title fees. Another piece of paper – another Fee (which is just another way of saying another tax).

At least this is a one-time hit.

Now the registration and tags. This is the gift that keeps on giving. Every year, forever.

To keep the registration up to date – which is necessary, if you wish to reduce the risk of being Tazered by a buzz-cut thug – it will cost you (in Virginia) about $50 per year, as mentioned above. Since most of us keep at least one car most of our adult lives, this will amount to a considerable sum over several decades of vehicle ownership. Let’s say 30 years. Times 50. That’s $1,500. Per vehicle. Double that if you have two. A typical two-car family will thus pay another $3,000 (probably more since the taxes – oops, “fees” – will certainly rise again over the years) to the Graspers in return for a slip of paper and a little sticker for their cars’ license plates.

Such a deal!

Oh, and then there’s the annual (in Virginia and many other states) mandatory state “safety” inspection. Time to stand and deliver – again. Another $20 out the window.

And don’t forget your “emissions” tax/test. Not everywhere (yet) and not annually (so far). But in most areas, another trickle of revenue for the Graspers that eventually feeds into a mighty Mississippi of confiscated wealth.

But still, we’re not done yet.

You’ll probably want to drive that car, right? Pay up! Every time you fill up.

The per-gallon tax on gasoline is, on average, 40-50 cents. Even with the massive uptick in fuel prices, regular unleaded would still be around $2.00 per gallon even now – if it weren’t for the taxes. A driver pays about $6 in taxes each time he fills up his average 15 gallon tank. Another couple hundred bucks each year – gone to the Graspers.

Now dollop on the mandatory insurance most states force every car owner to buy.

At the very least – assuming an absolutely unblemished “record” (almost impossible given the ubiquity of radar traps and the growing list of manufactured “offenses”), no claims filed against you and every allowance allowed – there goes another couple hundred out the window . Per vehicle (even though you can only drive one vehicle at a time) each year, every year. I’ve written about the cost of car insurance several times before. Over a driving lifetime, the total amount can add up to tens of thousands of dollars.

And don’t forget property taxes.

You may not have this one (yet) but we do here in the People’s Republic of Virginia. It’s a biggie – and like the registration tax it’s another way the Graspers pick your pockets every year if you own a motor vehicle. The tax is based on the average retail value, so even if you own a decrepit old beater that’s worth four or five thousand dollars, you ‘ll still be hit with a property tax bill of over $100 a year. Owners of later-model, higher-value vehicles pay several times that.

Every year. Forever. Or, as long as you own the thing.

I count eight separate taxes on cars (ownership and use), at least. Is this not startling? Even the IRS only comes around with its hand out (the other on its gun, of course) once a year. But if you own a car – and for most of us, owning a car is an essential – you’ll to open your wallet or purse multiple times each year, every year, for as long you can afford to “own” it. Which may not be very long. Which may be the underlying goal behind all these taxes.

Mobility and the masses – anathema to the element that controls things. If you can move around freely, easily, cheaply – you’re less under their thumb.

Impoverishing us via the debt of a thousand cuts is a very clever (because very subtle) method of stripping us of our liberty. Broke people struggling to earn another dollar so they can hand it over to the Graspers in return for being allowed to work (and the means to work) in order to earn another dollar to give to the Graspers have little time to consider the loss of their liberties – or the growing power of the Graspers. Fish learn to adapt to ever0-increasing concentrations of sewage in the water. People come to accept paying endless taxes to the Graspers. It becomes routine, the way things are.

But that doesn’t make them right.

Throw it in the Woods?
 

 

 

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  49 comments for “Debt by a Thousand Little Cuts….

  1. Desertrat
    July 27, 2011 at 6:48 pm

    A few quibbles, mostly have to do with changes from original intent. I’m old enough to remember some of those original intents, or at least heard about them in the Way Back When.

    The gasoline tax originated as a user-pay method for paying for construction of decent roads. It worked pretty well for a half-century.

    Some of the rationale for licensing was for record-keeping against theft and against hit-and-run. Fees to cover the book-keeping costs were held down for a long time.

    But, as we’ve all noted, Leviathan is insatiable for ever-increasing amounts of money, and trust funds can be diverted. Not only do taxes and fees increase, new taxes and fees come about with amazing regularity.

    As near as I can tell, the only solution is not considered to be socially acceptable…

    • dom
      July 27, 2011 at 6:58 pm

      No doubt, I hear you on the solution. Everything is such a freaking gimmick and the clovers love it all and ask for more!

  2. Dottie
    July 27, 2011 at 6:34 pm

    I finally bought myself a used car from a dealer. Those fees are outrageous. License, Title, Registration, Filing Fees: $33.50; VSI (what the hell is that?): 41.00; Documentary Service Charge To Seller $250.00; Sales Tax: $886.60. That doesn’t include the $900-sum odd dollars the bank charged me for the privilege of them servicing my loan. We shopped around for financing, including the credit union, and I have good credit. I’m not a Clover but I have to have a car. I see it as “playing the game.” You do your research and barter the best you can.

    • July 27, 2011 at 8:18 pm

      Hi Dottie,

      Congratulations on the new (to you) car!

      The multiple taxes/fees/charges they impose on vehicle ownership are outrageous. And we should never forget that we’re paying all those additional taxes/fees/charges with dollars that have already been taxed multiple times (federal state, possibly local) before we even buy anything with the remainder.

      July 4th and all the talk of “freedom” is a sick joke. The terrorists won a long time ago; long before 911.

    • dom
      July 28, 2011 at 12:11 am

      Well what did you buy?

      • Dottie
        July 28, 2011 at 1:20 pm

        I ended up buying a 2006 Kia Sportage with 47,000 miles on it.

      • Dottie
        July 28, 2011 at 1:55 pm

        I bought a 2006 Kia Sportage. Is there any mechanical issues I should keep an eye out for?

        • July 28, 2011 at 4:39 pm

          Hi Dottie,

          These are great little crossover SUVs; I think you’ll be very happy with it. The main thing with any used car is to make sure any necessary service is up to date; for example, with yours (being about 5 years old) I’d want to know when the cooling system was last serviced (if it hasn’t had a coolant flush/fill it likely needs it) and also the brakes (same issue; if it’s the original factory brake fluid, I’d have it flushed/refilled with fresh fluid). These are two of the common, neglected items. otherwise, you’re probably good to go for another 5-plus years before it needs more than an oil/filter change once a year or so.

          • Dottie
            July 28, 2011 at 7:38 pm

            Thanks for the tips. I believe the brakes are new. As for the coolant flush/fill, I’ll ask hubby, or I can just call the dealership and ask them if THEY did it during service.

            • July 28, 2011 at 8:22 pm

              On brakes: Make sure they changed the fluid – not just the pads/shoes. Brake fluid needs to be replaced every three years or so because it gets contaminated. If not changed, you run the risk of potentially big expenses such as a damaged ABS pump, ruined calipers, master cylinder, etc. You can visually check the condition of the fluid yourself. Open the hood, find the master cylinder. It will usually be located on the driver’s side of the firewall. Look for an item with a plastic/translucent reservoir. It should have two sections – one for the front brakes, the other for the rear (they’re separated so that in case on side fails, you still have some braking power). Unscrew (or pop off) the cover; look at the fluid. It should be the color of light cooking oil or honey. If it is amber (or darker) it is almost certainly old – and contaminated.

              On coolant: Even if you have so-called “long life” coolant, it should be changed every 4-5 years at the longest to avoid expensive cooling system problems such as a gunked up radiator. If the coolant is fresh, it should look bright neon green (or orange-red, if it’s the long-life stuff). If it’s brown-looking, it is time to change.

  3. Tom Hyland
    July 26, 2011 at 5:22 pm

    People must be made aware that, since 1933, within the first 100 days of the Roosevelt administration, all property belongs to the State. Here is my opinion of how America began…
    and when it ended.

    ALLODIUM   “Freehold estate; land which is the absolute property of the owner; real estate held in absolute independence, without being subject to any rent, service, or acknowledgement to a superior. It is thus opposed to feudal. In England, there is no allodial land, all land being held of the king; but in the United States, most lands are allodial.”  (That word and definition does not appear in most American dictionaries anymore.)

    On Sunday, March 4, 1933 Franklin Roosevelt was sworn in as the 32nd President of the United States. On Friday afternoon, March 9, he declared the United States bankrupt, by and through Executive Order Nos. 6073, 6102, 6111, and 6260.

    From Senate Resolution no. 62, adopted by the 73rd Congress, First Session, on April 24, 1933…

    “The ultimate ownership of all property is in the State; individual so-called “ownership” is only by virtue of Government, i.e., law, amounting to mere user; and use must be in accordance with law and subordinate to the necessities of the State.”

    If you folks would like to read of my adventures of what happened when I willfully closed my account at the New Mexico Motor Vehicle Department, click onto this link…
    http://www.usavsus.info/USA–TomHylandStory.htm

    • July 26, 2011 at 5:38 pm

      Tom,

      Great post. I’ve long believed that until we restore property rights in this country, we have little hope of restoring (or even saving what’s left of) other rights.

      Few people in this country know – or will permit themselves to know – that none of us, as individuals, “owns” anything more than whatever we can carry and probably not even that. We certainly do not own our homes and land, not even if they’ve been “paid off” for years. We are only permitted conditional use of our homes/land – and only so long as we pay the annual rental fee to the government.

      Again, thanks for the great post.

      • Tom Hyland
        July 26, 2011 at 6:12 pm

        And thank YOU, Eric. This is a great service to all by providing a website that informs the people of what, truly, the problem is. Our own government, in collusion with the Federal Reserve, disenfranchised the entire American population and reduced us all to tax-paying serfs. The very reason for the revolution of 1776 was the fact that the King owned EVERYTHING. All activities were licensed and highly regulated. Nobody owned their homes, farms, wagons, horses, crops, or anything. When it becomes common knowledge that We The People were returned to the exact same conditions of servitude back in 1933, then maybe there will be a reckoning. Senate Resolution No. 62 describes it perfectly clear… we are “mere users.” You may use your house or your car, and you may sell them to another “user” but he is never going to actually own these possessions either. That’s why the cops are not charged with grand theft auto when they tow your car and hold it in ransom… because the State OWNS your car. People should ask themselves this… if you are not allowed to own anything, what makes you think you’ve got any rights?

        • methylamine
          July 26, 2011 at 8:49 pm

          Tom I read your epic battle with the DMV.
          Do you still travel without a license, license plate, or registration?

          • Tom Hyland
            July 26, 2011 at 9:42 pm

            I was thrown in jail. After my case went entirely down the toilet, and I was laughed out of the court room, literally… I traveled around Santa Fe County for about three more months until I was pulled over. Sited for no drivers license, no insurance, no registration, the arraigning judge knew of my recent adventures in the higher courts. He sentenced me to three months jail time… unless I would agree to get licensed again.

            What’s the point of sitting in jail? I did this thing entirely alone. Though all of my friends supported me throughout my efforts, nobody else closed their account at MVD. I was only an annoying little gnat they crushed at their convenience. If hundreds, or thousands… would do what I did, this fraudulent house of cards would come tumbling down.

            I am licensed, insured, registered… and I wear my seat belt and observe the speed limits. Don’t tase me, bro…………

          • BrentP
            July 26, 2011 at 11:14 pm

            I read the webpage as well, and what I cannot believe is not getting laughed at the very first time. IME the *LAST* thing a traffic court judge is concerned about is the law.

          • dom
            July 27, 2011 at 3:07 am

            Holy smokes Tom! That is an amazing story. If only we could get hundreds of thousands to participate at once..

          • Tom Hyland
            July 27, 2011 at 4:24 am

            In my article I described how I attempted to enlist the help of my county Sheriff, Greg Solano. It was revealed this past November that this Sheriff spent most of his eight years in office stealing items from the supply room and selling them on eBay. He admitted his guilt in court last week and his sentencing hearing will be any day now. I guess Greg had a lot of other more important things to do than to serve and protect me when I really needed him.
            http://tinyurl.com/3s6loro

            • July 27, 2011 at 7:21 am

              About a month ago, in the adjacent county, a local “hero” cop confronted his ex-wife at a busy gas station, shot her to death, then took off… in his patrol car. No squealing about the Great Danger posed by government goons with guns. Just Ordinaries who have them.

              Clover’s head will explode when I tell him this, but at the risk of making a mess: One is much more likely to be shot or threatened with lethal violence by an armed, costumed government goon than by a citizen with a CWP.

              Guns don’t kill – but government does.

          • BrentP
            July 27, 2011 at 5:27 am

            Tom’s story got me looking at parts of the IL vehicle code I had not looked at before. While the definition of drive and driver (no driving) is generically operating a motor vehicle so they got that closed off… I found exceptions to having a DL, and one is rather interesting: “Any employee of the United States Government or any member of the Armed Forces of the United States, while operating a motor vehicle owned by or leased to the United States Government and being operated on official business need not be licensed;”

            So by magic of being employed by the federal government, one becomes a safe driver!

            • July 27, 2011 at 7:13 am

              Naturally.

              One standard for the Inner Party, another for the Outer Party.

              Just as (in Virginia) it is lawful for off-duty cops and DAs to conceal carry in restaurants that serve alcohol but illegal for ordinary CWP holders to do so – even if they are not drinking.

          • Edward King
            July 27, 2011 at 3:47 pm

            I think that the allowance of government thugs to concealed carry in places that serve alcohol is not so much out of fear of what will happen should a private citizen drink alcohol and become belligerent, but that he won’t. That last thing the state needs are numerous examples to the compliant clovers that ordinary people are able to handle responsibility. Clovers live with the mistaken impression that if his/her neighbor is not being shackled by the chains of the state, then all hell will break loose. Less government control and the resultant INCREASE in peace and prosperity will be the nail in the coffin to those who constantly fear what might happen should people be left alone.

            • July 27, 2011 at 4:36 pm

              That’s a really good point; I never thought about it from that perspective. And you’re exactly right. CWP holders are the least likely people, numerically, percentage-wise and otherwise, to be involved in a crime of violence involving a firearm. In every instance where CWP has been (finally) authorized for the broad masses, crime has gone down. “Shall issue” and “castle law” states are much safer states than areas where it is very difficult for a citizen to legally possess a gun or use it for self-defense. This relationship ought to be obvious – but Clovers are people with limited capacities addled by their emotions.

  4. That One Guy
    July 26, 2011 at 5:22 pm

    The nickel-and-diming continues apace in Washington state. Since so much of the transportation fund has gone to efforts to socially engineer more bicycle use in a climate that enjoys near-steady rain for 9 months of the year, a toll is going to be placed on the new 520 bridge across Lake Washington.

    Now, there is also the I-90 bridge across this lake, which is also ringed by Interstates 5 and 405. Who here thinks people wont bypass the state’s Big Brother-esque electronic “Good To Go” pass that is automatically scanned at tolling points (and would NEVER be used to track your movements of course), and just keep using the freeways they’re taxed only once for and not twice?

    Unfortunately the state has caught on and is now discussing requiring Good To Go for ALL FREEWAYS in the Seattle metro area. This is on top of the pilot program of turning that failed social engineering scheme known as the HOV lane into a special fee-for-travel lane with scanning points for your Good To Go pass, and cameras to look in your car and make sure you have two or more occupants and photograph your license plate for ticketing if you don’t. Thankfully a lack of funding is slowing further implementation of this system.

    What takes the cake though is Seattle’s repeated attempts to squeeze every last drop out of the golden goose. Seattle keeps trying to claim the ability to levy B&O taxes on ALL revenues of businesses that come into Seattle for any purpose. This would make all operations of UPS subject to taxation by Seattle if one single package was delivered here. Of course government, which is not subject to market realities, does not understand that UPS can simply choose not to service Seattle.

    But they do know that the idiots who live here would blame UPS for not submitting to rape, like they do the Boeing Company which cruelly asked for a 3-year no-strike clause from the aerospace machinists’ union and has attracted the ire of Obama’s NLRB for the having the audacity to hope they could freely choose to move this assembly line to right-to-work South Carolina.

    And the liberal Californians who fled here from their self-imposed hell 20 years ago and rolled up their sleeves to build the exact same nightmare here? They’ve started noticing it sucks and now have their eyes on Idaho and Montana.

    Liberals are like a plague of locusts.

    • July 26, 2011 at 5:42 pm

      “And the liberal Californians who fled here from their self-imposed hell 20 years ago and rolled up their sleeves to build the exact same nightmare here? They’ve started noticing it sucks and now have their eyes on Idaho and Montana.”

      Same here! We fled NorthernVirginia to get away from the Clovers (my turn for left-liberal statists as well as right-“conservative” statists) but already the assholes are popping up here in extremely rural SW Virginia, too.

      I’ve asked the question before: How do we keep the Clovers at bay?

      • BrentP
        July 26, 2011 at 11:34 pm

        Clovers are institutionalized people. The only way to keep them at bay is to not have institutions they can use. Any government body whatsoever that has use of legal violence is enough for them to get a start. Once they get started it is only a matter of time.

        It’s an odd sort of conditioned person that gets the ball rolling. They recognize the fundamental and unsolvable problems of their old area but think that only applies there. So they move to start over. It’s the “but with the right people” and/or “but if for enough power” everything would work aspect of statism. They think it will be different… this time. So they bring the disease to new frontiers.

        Perhaps a person becomes a libertarian or anarchist when he realizes that there aren’t any “right people” and there is never “enough power” to achieve utopia. I always had a libertarian mindset, but it was some time before I realized nobody is fit to run things, to manage society.

        I’ve debated various people who recognize the problems with the state and complain about them endlessly but believe those with libertarian views to be kooks. They cannot make the leap that government always turns out like this. They are endlessly looking to give the “right people” “enough” power to make things work. They cannot imagine life without government and believe in illusionary things like protection.

  5. Mark
    July 26, 2011 at 6:19 am

    Dear Eric, your description of these criminals, “Graspers,” is much too mild. I would prefer “Looters.” I would also go with “Parasites” and “Thugs.” Oops, what am I saying? Perhaps the best one is what I started with: “Criminals!”

    • July 26, 2011 at 9:33 am

      Hi Mark,

      In a way, they’re worse than thugs – for three reasons:

      * Thugs are more honest; they don’t tell you they’re beating you up or stealing your stuff “for your own good” or to “help” make society more “just.”
      * Thugs are less cowardly; they usually do their dirty work themselves vs. passing a “law” and the sending out armed goons to do it for them.
      * You can still legally fight back against a thug. If you fightback against a government Grasper, you know what happens next.

  6. dom
    July 25, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    The best part about the whole deal is that we receive tickets too! One would think after all those little cuts they would just make regular traffic tickets a “points only” violation. Think about all the taxes we pay with our homes too! Every utility/service has a tax incorporated. I love it. I wish we could get those old style striped outfits. I would request to have my own ball and chain and not be attached to anyone!


  7. Gil
    July 25, 2011 at 11:58 am

    So are you going to use fake stickers and documentation as well as deal in cash in hand? Are you going to fight the system or dutifully pay your dues?

    • July 25, 2011 at 3:32 pm

      Aussie Clover: “Dutifully pay my dues”? I don’t accept your Cloverian premise; that is, I have no “duty” to “dutifully” pay any gang of thugs anything.

      • Gil
        July 26, 2011 at 5:26 am

        Would you nitpick and prefer “obligation” over “dutifully”? But still would you prefer to have access to fake documentation over having to pay for real documentation?

        • July 26, 2011 at 9:27 am

          No, Aussie Cloveroni, because they amount to the same thing.

          What is it with you Clovers and your reverence for government? And what is government? Organized force or – put more colloquially – a bunch of people with titles, costumes and guns. And you happily accept whatever edicts, taxes, rules and regulations – whatever orders – these titled, costumed, violence-threatening goons come up with, because you’ve been so effectively conditioned to accept servility.

          • Gil
            July 26, 2011 at 10:35 am

            In other words, yes, you will grudgingly obey the laws than try to subvert the laws via non-violent, sneaky means. If you were on a soapbox in Nazi Germany you’d complain it’s total bull that Jews are being rounded up and when someone were to ask whether you would offer your home to become a safe house for any Jews seeking refuge, you’d reply “Hell no!”

            • July 26, 2011 at 11:14 am

              Clover, ever hear the saying, “run silent, run deep”?

              And, once again, I note your bizarre Cloverite juxtapositions:

              I advocate for liberty, hence I would complain that “it’s total bull that Jews are being rounded up in Nazi Germany.”

              The thought processes of a Clover are quite something!

              In fact – as has been repeatedly demonstrated here, by your own words and the words of your fellow Clovers – it is you and your kind who dismiss and trivialize the brutalization of individuals by the government. You’re the first to give the government the benefit of every doubt, no matter how implausible. To impute “noble” motives to its actions rather than malignant ones. To rationalize its coercion and threats of violence as “the price we pay for civilization” – and so on.

              Try to be intellectually consistent sometime… if you’re capable of it.

          • clover
            July 26, 2011 at 10:06 pm

            Have you been brutilized by our government today? Not me. What the heck. I wait day after day after day and still I have not been brutilized by the government. Have you? Has anyone that you know? I did not see it in the news today or yesterday or the day before that. Where is all that brutilizing happening?

            No Clovers

            • July 27, 2011 at 12:22 am

              “Brutalized,” Clover. I know you’re a product of government schools, but there is something called a dictionary.

              You and I and everyone else are threatened implicitly (and explicitly) by the government every day of our lives. We will be treated very brutally indeed if, for example, we were to assert the audacious claim that we own our home/land and don’t “owe” the government any of the taxes it declares we “owe.” We will be treated with even greater brutality by other agencies of the government for failing to comply. And we can expect brutal treatment at the hands of any random cop for such heinous crimes as failing to “buckle up for safety,” or by a TSA goon who for whatever reason or no reason at all decides to humiliate and degrade us by rifling our personal property and physically handling us, just for his (or her) sick kicks.

              You, a Clover, practice submission – hence, you’re left alone. For now. But eventually, Cloveroni, they’ll come for you, too. At the very least, you’ll play Brutality Roulette – meaning, you’ll live your life with the ever-present threat of random, arbitrary government-sponsored violence raining down upon yo’ hay-ud. Because that’s what random and arbitrary government tends to do.

              You think: I am a good little Clover. I submit and obey. I am safe. But if you weren’t a Clover – if you weren’t ignorant, if you knew human history and humannature – you’d understand otherwise. You’d know that submitting and obeying didn’t keep the people of the Soviet Union or Nazi Germany or Mao’s China or Kim’s Korea safe – and it won’t keep you safe, either.

          • July 27, 2011 at 2:54 am

            You know, Clover, you are as about as useful as Adolf Hitler.

            • July 27, 2011 at 7:02 am

              He’s worse. His type makes Hitlers possible.

              It is instructive to read Hitler’s speeches from that era; they’re liberally salted with the “safety” and “security” cant that Clovers seem drawn to like moths to a flame.

          • clover
            July 29, 2011 at 2:38 am

            And when was the last time that you have been tazed and a gun pulled on you and being assaulted for not not wearing a seat belt. Nice story but you could at least come up with an example of such a case if it is an every day occurance like yuo say it is.

            No Clovers

            • July 29, 2011 at 10:29 am

              Clover, do you also believe that if you personally have not been mugged that muggers don’t exist?

              The only reason I haven’t been in conflict with some thug cop is because I haven’t yet been on the wrong side of the odds. I live in a very rural area and I work out of the house so I don’t have as high a risk profile.

              But that’s not the issue; you’re too dense to grasp that just because something hasn’t happened to me (or to you) it doesn’t mean it can’t happen to us – or hasn’t happened to many others already.

              Because you’re a Clover.

        • clover
          July 29, 2011 at 1:37 am

          I do not think that stopping somoen for lack of wearing a seat belt is cruel and harsh and unrelenting. That is the definition that some here give to it.

          A link for the guy that does not believe in insurance. Can he pay for this accident in 20 lifetimes?

          No Clovers

          • July 29, 2011 at 2:01 am

            Of course not – because you’re a Clover!

            Try to follow the chain of events:

            * A cop pulls you over for not wearing a seat belt.
            * You do not in any way threaten the cop (or anyone else) but you decline to comply with his order that you buckle up.

            What happens next, Cloveroni?

            The cop will threaten you with violence. He will then use violence – assault you, using either a Tazer or his gun or his hands.

            For nothing more than refusing to obey an order he has o business giving in the first place.

            Just one small example. There list is long – and growing.

            We live in a Clover State, a place where it’s no longer sufficient to be an honest, peaceful person just going about his business in order to avoid threats of violent assault and actual assault by costumed thugs empowered by Clovers.

            People like you are despicable because of the casual – and cowardly – way you advocate for and amen violence toward others, but done by someone else. You get off controlling others, but would never dare try to control anyone on your own.

          • July 29, 2011 at 9:59 pm

            Clover, no doubt, believes the man who suffered this assault somehow deserved it. In fact, if it were happening to him, he’d believe he deserved it, and would ask for more:

            [CAUTION – GRAPHIC] Chilling Video Captures Man’s Cries For Help As He Is Tased And Beaten To Death (by cops) – http://www.pixiq.com/article/citizen-video-captures

            • July 29, 2011 at 10:36 pm

              One of the worst aspects (and there are many) of all this is the unwarranted – rapid and violent – escalation, often out of all proportion to the original; “offense” and when the “offender” is clearly no physical threat to the cop or anyone else.

              For example, there’s the infamous case of the Texas woman who was pulled over for a minor traffic violation; I think it was a seatbelt violation. The woman – a mom with her kids in the car – argues with the cop, rather than being immediately servile and submissive. The cop – a large man – assaults her for “resisting,” ultimately Tazering her, forcing her to the ground and handcuffing her in front of her kids.

              Now, granted, it may not be smart to mouth off to a cop. But this was blown out of all proportion, given the minor nature of the “offense.” And of course, the woman was in no way any threat to the cop.

              But we now have a system in place that not only permits but encourages an over-the-top response to trivialities such as failing to “buckle up for safety” or objecting to a pat-down by a GED reject TSA goon.

              The root problem is that we have such laws in the first place. Cops should not be put in the position of having to enforce ridiculous – and tyrannical – petty edicts that naturally get people’s backs up, because people quite rightly object to being handled like petty criminals or talked down to like an idiot child over something that is – in a sane society – absolutely none of the cop’s business in the first place.

        • clover
          July 29, 2011 at 2:42 am

          Did anyone see the Rand Paul interview the other day? He said he was not going to vote for anything unless it was exactly what he wanted in a bill. He does not care if you and the country goes down the tubes because of it. His principals are more important.

          No Clovers

          • BrentP
            July 29, 2011 at 3:36 am

            If principles mattered the country wouldn’t be going down the tubes in the first place.

            But what happens differently if Rand Paul votes to kick the can as you’d like him to? Nothing. The can will be kicked either way he votes.

            The only way to stop the country from this travel down the tubes is to stop kicking the can and deal with the fundamental problems before they get even worse.

            • July 29, 2011 at 10:33 am

              A famous author came up with the cumbersome (but still descriptive) term for Cloverian thought processes: She called it the “anti-conceptual mentality.” People who are not able to grasp principles or think in terms of broad concepts. Such people never connect the the proverbial dots; instead, they see life as a series of discreet events, none having any bearing on others or a broader mosaic. Thus, sobriety checkpoints are just about “getting dangerous drunks off the road” and don’t represent a dangerous precedent that can (and has been) expanded to other things, such as TSA gate rapes. Etc.

    • Brent P
      July 26, 2011 at 4:59 am

      Pay dues… I love how statists (clovers) think that extractions of wealth and property by force are “dues” as if this were some sort of voluntary club. Even more amusing is a typical view that goes along with that one. A view that private businesses charge too much for food, rent, anything that is well actually a competitive business where customers are purchasing voluntarily.

      To think about it, that’s a key difference between libertarians and statists. Libertarians like the market and know so long as there is choice to go elsewhere or without and new businesses can enter the market high prices are temporary. Statists think the government solves everything by freezing prices high and higher forever by eliminating choice.

      Back to road taxes… Eric, other than the property tax which is a killer and the inspections VA is cheap… 8% sales tax on a new car here in c(r)ook county Illinois, state reg is double VA’s. Guess if they don’t get us one way they get us another.

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